Outside the Beltway

Thursday Tab Clearing

Steven L. Taylor
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31 responses to “Thursday Tab Clearing”

  1. Neil Hudelson Avatar
    Neil Hudelson

    I was just getting ready to post the article on True the Vote on the open thread, and thought I’d read the tab clearing post first. From the article Conservative group tells judge it has no evidence to back its claims of Georgia ballot stuffing:

    Texas-based True the Vote filed complaints with Georgia Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger in 2021, including one in which it said it had obtained “a detailed account of coordinated efforts to collect and deposit ballots in drop boxes across metro Atlanta” during the November 2020 election and a January 2021 runoff. […]

    The election board subpoenaed True the Vote to provide evidence that would assist it in investigating the group’s ballot trafficking allegations. […]

    Frustrated by the group’s refusal to share evidence, Georgia officials took it to court last year. A judge ordered True the Vote to turn over names and contact information for anyone who had provided information, as well as any recordings, transcripts, witness statements or other documents supporting its allegations.

    They were so used to the fact-free, pushback-free environment of the conservative entertainment complex that they forgot the real world still exists. They thought the court system would play along like Fox News does.

    What I didn’t see in the article is if there’s any punishment awaiting TtV. Can one be fined for filing frivolous claims and wasting the time of multiple government agencies?

    11
  2. Kathy Avatar
    Kathy

    Wait. So being named Kennedy does not confer on anyone political smarts? Is all our misunderstanding of genetics wrong?

    2
  3. Joe Avatar
    Joe

    I had two reactions to the Only Fans influencer kerfuffle. The first, “how else is an local school instructor gonna make ends meet” which drove me to go look at the story, which included that very point. The second was that the instructor is Rachel Dolezal, the former NCAA chair who got outed as not black a few years ago. Apparently, she moved to Tuscon and changed her name and – to my first point – is having trouble making ends meet.
    I do think it’s problematic to under employ people and then ding them for making other money in legal ways.

    4
  4. Jen Avatar
    Jen

    @Neil Hudelson:

    Can one be fined for filing frivolous claims and wasting the time of multiple government agencies?

    Yes.

    7
  5. Kylopod Avatar
    Kylopod

    On the subject of Biden’s age, I’d like to make a very, very, very qualified defense of Jon Stewart after his not-exactly-universally-well-received return to The Daily Show.

    It’s not a defense of the segment itself. I thought it was bad and beneath Stewart’s talents. Not only did he suggest without good evidence that Biden has in fact shown diminished mental faculties, he spent half the segment basically lecturing his audience in a preemptive attempt to ward off the backlash he knew was coming. If nothing else, that’s not a good recipe for comedy.

    But… I think a lot of us long-time Stewart fans look back at his stint on TDS through the haze of nostalgia. He’s always had flaws. Bothsiderism is nothing new for him. (Remember the Rally to Restore Sanity?) He’s always fallen back on the idea that he just calls it like he sees it (he said this repeatedly during his famous encounter with Tucker in 2004). Also, let’s face it, cheap shots based on vanishingly brief out-of-context clips were practically the show’s bread and butter.

    Let me be clear–I still believe that Stewart ultimately rose above these tendencies and delivered some of the best and most insightful political comedy in a generation.

    And even though I think Monday’s segment was an embarrassing failure, I saw what he was trying to say and it wasn’t all bad. It wasn’t just an extended hacky old-man-joke routine, as some critics suggested. It was a warning to Democrats and anyone else who’s fearful of a second Trump term, that they should not become blind to Biden’s weaknesses, in optics if not in substance. And yes, I do think some Biden supporters are falling into that trap. It’s not the most stunning insight he could have come up with, but it is relevant.

    I know Stewart is still capable of good political comedy. His Apple TV show proved it. His Monday segment was not a good start, but we still should give him a chance.

    5
  6. Matt Bernius Avatar
    Matt Bernius

    @Neil Hudelson:
    I have a post on that going up later today.

    It will be spicy.

    2
  7. DK Avatar
    DK

    @Kylopod: Is there really any phalanx of Biden supporters who aren’t terrified about the 2024 election? I keep seeing commenters warn against Democratic complacency…but where is it? Everywhere I look, Biden supporters high and low are engaged and/or worried.

    Anti-Trumpers have spent the last eight years in perpetual freakout mode. I doubt many who care about The Daily Show thinks 2024 is going to be a cake walk. Defending Biden’s record from attacks they think are wrong headed is de rigeur politics, it doesn’t mean Biden’s defenders think he is flawless.

    Jon Stewart is not a daisy or a sacred cow. He’s not above critique, and he has many fans. He’ll be fine.

    3
  8. CSK Avatar
    CSK

    With respect to dumping red dust on the Constitution: Some idiots threw soup at the Mona Lisa the other day, also to protest climate change.

    1
  9. Steven L. Taylor Avatar
    Steven L. Taylor

    @Joe:

    I do think it’s problematic to under employ people and then ding them for making other money in legal ways.

    To be clear, I concur. I was just amazed that Dolezal was the person in question.

    4
  10. Steven L. Taylor Avatar
    Steven L. Taylor

    @Kylopod: More than the jokes, I found the interview segment weird. I get the notion that, in the abstract, there are reasons to prefer a younger candidate, but this is all just getting a bit silly in terms of what reality is.

    4
  11. Beth Avatar
    Beth

    Reading this:

    Given Johnson‘s three-seat majority, conservatives have the power to successfully obstruct any spending deal that comes before the House Rules Committee. So Republicans are expecting they will have to rely on Democratic votes in taking up a final funding plan using a procedural gambit that requires a two-thirds majority of the House, a procedural maneuver that Johnson has used several times to sidestep his fractious right flank.

    I don’t see how the idiots, fire breathers, and carnival barkers in the GOP avoid a government shutdown and/or the ouster of Johnson. One of those idiots is going to work something so poisonous to Dems that Jeffries will say FU and then the whole thing is going up. Or Johnson will be forced to cut a deal and the Gaetz faction will slit his (and their) throats.

    Maybe these meds are wringing any optimism out of me, but every day we tick closer to November is going to get worse.

    3
  12. Kylopod Avatar
    Kylopod

    @DK:

    I keep seeing commenters warn against Democratic complacency…but where is it?

    I agree that there’s far more panic than complacency among Biden supporters. The level of complacency we saw in 2016–where most people, I’m convinced, became so certain about Hillary’s coming victory that when Trump won it was downright surreal to them–is as dead and gone as T. Rex. Pretty much everyone realizes Trump can win again.

    But I do think there is some level of self-deception among some Biden supporters about Biden’s age-related issues. I don’t believe he’s going senile, but I cringe every time he appears. He’s become veeeeery slow and looks and sounds veeeeery frail. He looks like a wind-up doll winding down. I saw it starting to happen back in 2019 and it’s only grown worse. And he was never exactly the most electrifying speaker.

    How many Dems realize this? Many do. But believe me, I’ve interacted with plenty of Biden supporters, here and elsewhere, and there is some level of effort being used to minimize it and try to avoid seeing the obvious.

    Like I said, this isn’t some earth-shattering revelation and I do think Stewart went way too far in his criticism. Everyone has their echo chambers, and pointing out that rather obvious point is about the most base-level and uninteresting critique a person can make about today’s politics.

    4
  13. MarkedMan Avatar
    MarkedMan

    @DK:

    I keep seeing commenters warn against Democratic complacency…but where is it? Everywhere I look, Biden supporters high and low are engaged and/or worried.

    I’m with you. There is a tendency for certain Dems that when they are confronted with someone posting, say, “The Suozzi election came off better than I expected”, with “YOU FOOL! Here are reasons why that’s actually bad news! AND BIDEN IS OLD!”

    Something I’ve said since the swift-boating of John Kerry: There is always something. If one thing doesn’t work Republicans will keep trying new things until something sticks. And when does something stick? As soon as enough Dems start rending their garments and saying, “It isn’t true but it raises questions! Oh, Whoa is us! If only we had a different candidate!”

    5
  14. wr Avatar
    wr

    @Kylopod: “But I do think there is some level of self-deception among some Biden supporters about Biden’s age-related issues.”

    Seriously? What are Biden supporters supposed to do — rend our garments and fall to the floor shrieking whenever he looks or acts old?

    We get it. He’s old. Everyone knows it. Maybe to some that’s the only important fact about the man. But you know, I supported Hillary and was able to talk about her without prefacing every sentence with “Well, of course she had a private email server.”

    Not in denial. In acceptance.

    10
  15. wr Avatar
    wr

    @MarkedMan: What are the odds we’d both refer to rending garments. All props to you — you did it first!

    1
  16. Gavin Avatar
    Gavin

    Yea, Joe is old.

    Trump is both old and demented.

    As always, every accusation from a Republican is a confession.

    6
  17. Just nutha ignint cracker Avatar
    Just nutha ignint cracker

    @Gavin: Don’t leave out not up to the job to begin with when talking about Trump. That was always factor number one!

    1
  18. steve Avatar
    steve

    Let’s have a national investigation on stealing the vote. Let’s subpoena every group making claims that they have evidence. Remind them that lying to investigators is a crime. Would be fun!

    Steve

    4
  19. MarkedMan Avatar
    MarkedMan

    @wr: I guess we both like to stick to the classics!

  20. wr Avatar
    wr

    @MarkedMan: Or we both need some new clothes!

  21. DK Avatar
    DK

    @Kylopod: How could Democrats possibly be deceived about Biden’s age-related issues when Jon Stewart and everybody else talks about them every day?

    No Democrat thinks Joe Biden is 41, not 81. Biden is an old man. We know, because we were told today, yesterday, the day before that, last week, last month, the last five years, and will be reminded another 8,429.2 times before November. I think some who are hyperfixated on Biden’s age are deceiving themselves about why some Democrats have started tuning them out: not denial, but because it’s getting gratingly tedious as ringing in the ear. (Hence why Stewart’s debut was met with “meh” and “ugh, not again.”)

    Democrats cannot put Biden in a magic makeover machine and make him younger, and the country doesn’t need Biden supporters to pile on about his age: Republicans, the media, and panicking anti-Trumpers of all stripes will talk about Biden’s age enough to cover all of us several times over.

    So since all the sticks being used to beat the Biden’s age horse to a pulp are already in use, some Democrats are choosing to highlight for voters less talked-about subjects — like how Biden’s presidential successes and competence demonstrate his age and experience are assets, while his also-old opponent is an extremist, rambling disaster.

    I think this is what Democrats should be doing, while Jon Stewart is trying to make the millionth Biden’s age joke sound fresh.

    10
  22. OzarkHillbilly Avatar
    OzarkHillbilly

    @Neil Hudelson: I await the dropping of a lawsuit or charges against them for filing false reports with the Georgia SoS’ office. And or depending on what they filed in this case, severe contempt of court fines from the judge. I also wonder if the lawyers can be sanctioned by the Bar.

    @Gavin: And a criminal. and a pervert. and serially bankrupt. and a fascist. and a… You get the idea.

    2
  23. Stormy Dragon Avatar
    Stormy Dragon

    Re: Jon Stewart

    While a big TDS fan back in the day, it’s one if those things I don’t look back fondly on. While it certainly wasn’t his intention, I think Stewart is actually a major cause of many of the problems we face today as he was one of the most successful practioners of a style of comedy that encourages a detached, cynical, “everything is ironic” view of society that eventually metastasizes into a sort of morally nihilistic alienation that makes one super susceptible to far-right recruitment.

    If you’ve ever seen The Alt-Right Playbook’s “How to Radicalize a Normie” video, I would contend that Stewart played a big hand in creating a lot of “Gabe’s”.

    1
  24. dazedandconfused Avatar
    dazedandconfused

    @Stormy Dragon:

    I perceived his message as “The system that produced a binary choice between two people obviously past their prime and/or deeply flawed for the toughest job in the world is broken”, and was mildly disappointed he did not delve deeper into what’s broken. IMO it’s because the pool of people who are willing to subject themselves and their family to the circus is miniscule.

    1
  25. Michael Reynolds Avatar
    Michael Reynolds

    I have a different take on Jon Stewart. I think he’s looking at the existing late night comedy world where Colbert and Kimmel hammer Trump every night and make benign jokes about Biden’s age. Jon needs to position himself in that environment and differentiate his show.

    But my larger point is, I think he’s grounding his narrative in reality. Yes, Biden is old, and yes according to Jon and pretty much everyone, it’s going to be a thing all the way through to November. We can’t deny it and we can’t be afraid of it, we have to metabolize it fully, aikido the issue and redirect energy to more meaningful policy questions. We can’t get bogged down in this, can’t be dragged into endless minor eruptions.

    Maybe I’m giving Jon too much credit. Don’t know the dude. But if it was me, and I anticipated telling a very partisan story over the course of months, I’d dial back the early partisan takes just a hair, and buy some credibility by Sister Souljah-ing it. Our position can’t be, “Don’t talk about Biden’s age,” that’s a weak place. It has to be, ‘Yeah, we know he’s old, wish he wasn’t, but the economy is roaring, and he’s not going to prison, etc…”

    4
  26. Michael Reynolds Avatar
    Michael Reynolds

    @Stormy Dragon:
    Jon Stewart is an acolyte of David Letterman who taught a whole generation irony. But Kimmel and Colbert are also Letterman babies and both their shows are deeply political and very much on the side of the angels. Their audiences are clearly still very engaged politically, or the networks would have shut them down. I don’t know that earnestness is more motivating than irony. Many of us find earnestness insufferable.

    1
  27. Kylopod Avatar
    Kylopod

    @Stormy Dragon:

    While it certainly wasn’t his intention, I think Stewart is actually a major cause of many of the problems we face today as he was one of the most successful practioners of a style of comedy that encourages a detached, cynical, “everything is ironic” view of society that eventually metastasizes into a sort of morally nihilistic alienation that makes one super susceptible to far-right recruitment.

    I’ve given my criticisms of Stewart already. But I disagree with you. I didn’t see anything cynical or nihilistic about his approach to politics. If anything, what you describe was more the norm in the SNL model for political humor, which TDS moved away from after Stewart took over. A heavy focus of his show was attacking the sensationalism and superficialty of mainstream media, and indeed one of his weaknesses which sometimes cut against his attempts at comedy was that he had a habit of becoming lectury and self-righteous–the opposite of cynical nihlism.

    One thing about him that isn’t discussed much is that he’s long shown a surprising strength speaking about topics related to health care–his coverage of Obamacare, his later work on 9/11 responders, to his recent coverage of legislation banning medical care for trans people.

    I would say that one of his contributions to political comedy was proving you could do it while also showing you gave a damn.

    3
  28. wr Avatar
    wr

    @Michael Reynolds: Yes… but did you think it was funny?

  29. Ken_L Avatar
    Ken_L

    @Neil Hudelson: The True the Vote folk have responded furiously that they did too hand over lots of evidence supporting their claims. It was lots and lots of statistical data from cell phone companies which the Georgia authorities were too lazy or dumb to analyse properly! For that you need a first-class mathematician like Dinesh d’Souza.

  30. Just nutha ignint cracker Avatar
    Just nutha ignint cracker

    @Ken_L:

    It was lots and lots of statistical data from cell phone companies which the Georgia authorities were too lazy or dumb to analyse properly! For that you need a first-class mathematician like Dinesh d’Souza.

    Now that was funny!

    4
  31. Michael Reynolds Avatar
    Michael Reynolds

    @wr:
    Not really. I could have written the actual jokes – and I can’t write jokes.

    I tried once, had this concept that would have required me to be able to write bits of stand-up. Quickly realized those people have different brains with different foci. They’ve spent their lives looking for funny. It wasn’t something I could fake.

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