Thurdsday’s Forum
Steven L. Taylor
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Thursday, November 13, 2025
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66 comments
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About Steven L. Taylor
Steven L. Taylor is a Professor Emeritus of Political Science and former College of Arts and Sciences Dean. His main areas of expertise include parties, elections, and the institutional design of democracies. His most recent book is the co-authored
A Different Democracy: American Government in a 31-Country Perspective. He earned his Ph.D. from the University of Texas and his BA from the University of California, Irvine. He has been blogging since 2003 (originally at the now defunct Poliblog).
Follow Steven on
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BlueSky.
Juan Ponce Enrile has died. He was 101. Enrile was one of the most instrumental figures in the People Power Revolution that ended Ferdinand Marcos reign as leader of the Philippines. RIP.
The headline of the day- Ferry shocks passengers by mistakenly playing porn on lounge TV
The
runner upfood headline of the day- Customer finds maggots in croissantThe members of my condo’s HOA voted down having our building elevator repaired. It was going to cost $200,000.
Why? Each owner was going to face an assessment of over three thousand dollars. Dear Wife voted for the repair. Owners here are crossing their fingers. Either they die or move out of the building before the elevator goes kaput.
The result of last night’s vote was predictable.
@Bill Jempty:
Wow, only 3 grand? We have just passed two assessments over the last three years for siding (12 grand) and this year a roof (6 grand) sure we had a few bitch about it. One co-owner decided to hold out until just before the Board put the unit up for sale. The guy had to pay the assessment and the lawyer’s fee.
On the other hand we can’t vote on it. And the remedy for non-payment is they sell your unit.
@Rick DeMent:
72 owners times $3154 is over 220 grand. I think the repair cost was 195k . The HOA is sitting on a very large reserve fund and the board was trying to hold down the assessment a little in hope owners would pass the resolution. That strategy didn’t work.
How building a new hospital cost this rural Texas town a place to deliver babies
The closest obstetrics unit is 60 miles.
Interesting financial metric:
The Medicaid cuts in the OBBB will make it worse.
If you’re depending on attorneys to provide guidance for what legal or not legal, you won’t find them in the DoD.
DOJ drafts legal opinion backing immunity for US troops involved in boat strikes, sources say
And, of course, there is the increasing tendency to provide justification after the fact. Which makes everything suspect.
Some months ago I bought new PCs mostly because Windows 10 won’t be getting updates much longer.
I wish I was still using my 7 year old windows 10 laptop
Why?
The toolbar is on the bottom of the computer screen and can’t be moved to the side.
Windows 11 required me to buy a more recent more recent version of Strat-0-matic baseball and this version is full of mistakes. Like wishing Chad Kreuter a happy birthday during a 1963 game and Kreuter wasn’t born till 1964.
My music files from old PC, didn’t automatically show after being transferred to the new machine. I had to click through all of them. Oh and the Legacy Windows player doesn’t show them at all to this day.
Ad blocker requires me in Firefox browser to click on ads before Ad blocker blocks them.
Some ad at AOL mail is causing me to get repeated bitdefender suspicious connection notifications. Like over 500 in the last two weeks.
I wasn’t having either of the last two problems when using the windows 10 laptop. The last time I used that PC was about 10 days ago*.
There was must be a blue moon or the apocalypse is right around the corner because I’m writing a computer tech related post.
*- Because I’m discovering there is still files on it that I want for one reason or another.
Transgender members of the Air Force sue over losing retirement pay
These are earned benefits. There is no bottom to this administration.
I would like to petition for our MAGAt trolls to be allowed back on OTB. I think we should really, really, really hear Drew’s explanation of Trump’s child-raping and how it doesn’t matter because: stock market.
@Michael Reynolds: Good luck with that. Even when he wasn’t banned it was always a fool’s errand getting Drew to even respond to a point. This in fact has generally been true about most of banned commenters: they’ll say it was about their not conforming to OTB’s groupthink, when it actually was their complete refusal to engage with anyone who disagreed with them. Their consistent approach has been to drop stink bombs in threads and proceed to ignore all rebuttals.
@Michael Reynolds:
Why? Dishonest bs adds no value here.
MAGA explanations:
“I fell for Trump’s charismatic con job.”
“Trump is a liar and so am I.”
“Trump hates the minorities I hate.”
“I’m just not very smart.”
We’re a decade in. It’s explained already.
Viral on socials this week:
@ImBreakWorsham (The Patriotic Blonde)
6 Nov 2025, 4:15PM
This is the only thing we really need to hear from Trumpers.
Chris Rossini, of something called The Ron Paul Institute:
Clinton Russell, host of The Liberty Lockdown podcast (11 Nov):
Rep. Thomas Massie, to CNN:
Viral tweets from @ConservativeGirl (12 Nov)
Matt Morse, MAGA podcast host:
@Bill Jempty:
I’m not sure I understand what you want to do with the taskbar, but you might want to look at Start 11.
I don’t use it myself, but I did purchase and install Start8 on my laptop before Win10 was released. It turned the cursed WINDOS into a desktop OS.
I think there’s s free trial, too.
I think right now the love of money really is gonna do us all in.
All trump is is a walking for sale sign.
Errybody knows.
@DK: All these folks are saying is that Trump is not as gross, disgusting, venal, hateful, ignorant, petty, etc. as they are.
@DK:
If these people had lived in Germany in the 1940s, they’d be complaining Elon hitler is soft on Jews.
@Scott: Seems like a mishmash of upset about inflation/prices, Epsteingate, H1B visas, and Trump’s closeness to the Arab/Muslim world. And the anti-Israel Groyper right is convinced Trump is controlled by the Jooooos.
Viral @info_maiden tweet, accompanied by photo of a burning MAGA hat:
Michael Allen Adams, developer and MAGA author:
The Patriotic Blonde, 12 Nov:
MAGA comic, Dave Smith:
“At this point, we’re essentially living through Biden’s second term with a secured border.”
Response: “Its not secure if Trump is importing them in.”
Response: Selling American jobs to foreigners for $100k because Americans aren’t talented enough. That’s not America first that’s Trump first.
Response: “At least Biden was importing low wage immigrants.
Trump is getting rid of low wage immigrants and importing high wage immigrants because Americans “don’t have the skills.
Instead of learning to code, Americans will need to learn how to roof houses, mow lawns, and change hotel bed sheets.”
Erick Erickson, longtime RWNJ:
Trump’s backing of H-1B visa program exposes cracks within MAGA movement (Fox News)
Amity Lee, commenting on Trump hosting the Syrian president:
What’s actually happening is some of Trump’s base is spooked by the breadth and depth of their 2025 election losses, and the realization Trump’s economy and policies are widely hated.
Post-COVID socioeconomic shocks are still rippling through the West. Worsened in the US by this pedo president’s unforced errors (regressive taxation via inflationary tariffs, fascist domestic military deployments, out-of-touch gold ballrooms and Gatsby parties, Argentine bailouts, Obamacare attacks, deportation of critical labor, masked ICE goons terrorizing kids).
So the public’s post-COVID anxiety and anger is still raging. And unfortunately for Republicans they are the incumbents now.
So, according to Gallup, 40% of young women would leave America if they could. 20% would leave nationwide.
Highest numbers ever. Coincides with the maga takeover of the gop.
Meidas Touch has read through all the emails. Among the nuggets Epstein saying Trump is a disgusting person, worse in person, indeed, evil. And Epstein was in frequent contact with the Russians, explicitly offering them kompromat on Trump.
Epstein to Putin to Trump on his knees.
Many of you will remember that I have said from very early on that Putin had dirt on Trump – not just his grossness, not just his stupidity but financial crimes and sexual predation. Then the Epstein stuff started coming out in earnest and suddenly, Trump was standing up to Putin. I theorized that it was because Putin’s blackmail info no longer had value since it was coming out anyway.
In fact, Putin playing that card now might even help Trump since Trump could claim the whole thing was somehow Russian disinformation. Here’s the timeline:
1. Trump kisses Putin’s ass tolerating regular insults he’d never tolerate from anyone else.
2. Epstein files start to come out, and inevitably more TK.
3. Trump turns on Putin.
So, everyone who sneered and dismissed both my theory that Putin had Trump under his thumb, and the later, Part 2, that the Epstein reveals rendered Putin’s kompromat irrelevant, still think I’m suffering from an overactive imagination?
ETA: A speculation: Trump, worried that this all might come out, has been grooming the American people and the media by gross acts intended to desensitize the public.
@DK:
Well, I would have also liked this Trumper to apologize to all of the rest of us who didn’t fall for his BS 3 TIMES.
@DK:
In regard to the second MAGAt you quoted:
Notice that sweeping the Democrats back into power is regarded as worse than the litany which includes destroying the US economy, and achieving maximum poverty, chaos, and collapse.
To quote Adam Savage “There’s your problem!”
@Michael Reynolds: Now this is interesting. I’ve been wondering what on EARTH could be in those files that would actually matter, because as you correctly note, we’ve ALL become somewhat desensitized to allegations surrounding Trump.
If there’s firm evidence in those files that Russia, Russia, Russia isn’t a “hoax,” a lot starts to fall apart.
Who’da thunk Laura Ingraham would help expose MAGA’s god-king?
Analysis: Trump fact-checks himself on whether Americans pay for his tariffs (CNN)
Trump’s Shocking Brawl With Laura Ingraham on Fox Exposes His Weakness (TNR)
@Kathy:
It was noticed and noted. I laughed.
@Kathy:
Kathy,
Before I ask for your help, let me warn you
I’m Captain Kirk’s masochistic twin when it comes to PCs. I can wreck only ones I operate.
The late and beloved Hitch, who I hired to prepare story files for me so I could sell paperbacks and hardcovers not just ebooks at Amazon KDP, was told by me many times- “I’ve uploaded 20 ebooks to Amazon KDP and only once had a problem. What I did right, I still don’t know.”
Now as Paul Harvey would have said, it is time for the rest of the story
After I read your post, I downloaded Start 11 free trial offer. Now I can move the taskbar to the right side and can pin programs to my start page that I use all the time. I set Start 11 for Windows 10 version.
Bad news- When playing my baseball games, up to 11 things on the task bar in windows 10 or 11 showing so I can click on the game I’m playing. Now after installing Start 11, it just shows one thing on the task bar for strat-o-matic. To get to the game I want to play, I have to click that thing.
I’d like Start 11 to show the 11 things on my task bar like it was before I downloaded that program. Your assistance, if you’re familar with Start 11 and can understand the gobbleygook I wrote above, would be appreciated. Remember what I wrote above concerning my computer skills. I’m going to eat lunch and take my afternoon nap so there is no rush if you can help me. I’ll check in sometime 2 or later Florida time.
@Jen:
So, I’m starting to think that this Epstein shit is way way worse than what we’ve already seen. Last year, I would have thought that it was 100% bullshit. As much as I hate saying this, I think @Michael Reynolds: is right.
Another thing that is coming out of this now is just how many people have had to hide this shit to cover for various powerful people. First, SUPERMOTHERFUCK MERRICK GARLAND. That motherfucker knew or should have know what was in that and he should have dumped it wholesale in 2021. Garland should be tied ass to mouth to Musk, stuffed in a rocket and fired at Mars.
Second, every living president and attorney general needs to be asked under oath, what did you know and when did you know it. Cause it really looks to me that these MAGA idiots were on to something. Hawk Harrelson used to say “right size, wrong shape”, that’s what this is appearing to be. Larry Summers, the NYT, Bill Gates. All of these fuckers need to account for this.
@Scott: Here are some of the comments to the Facebook posting of this article:
@Scott:
I would note also that these Transgender (ex) troops have more balls than Trump, who lied about bone spurs because he was afraid of serving in the military.
Checking again; has anyone received their $2,000 tariff refund check?
Re: “Epstein files”:
As I said yesterday: my speculation is that the reason the “Andrew who was formerly Prince” was strapped into the royal ejector seat last fortnight is because the UK security services, not being utterly idiotic, have a reasonable idea about what is about to come out, and how toxic it’s going to be.
That even if there were further dirt on A.M-W, any connection at all is going stink to high heaven
Which also indicates why Mandelson was sacked; and raises questions about whether he was seriously vetted in the first palce.
The main thing about this is, Trump being Trump, can anyone think of any plausible reason why, if this was not a threat to him personally, he would be burning political capital to try to hold the line on this?
If it just affected associates and partners, he might well try to bury it.
But even given Trump’s notorious stubborness and stupidity, would he really play such a risky game just to cover for somebody else?
@Daryl: Trump keeps talking about the refund. But I hope (or at least he has been told) that it is not his to give out. Like all things money, that is a congressional responsibility. National debt or deficit reduction anyone?
@Michael Reynolds:
As someone who’s repeatedly been inclined to be a bit sceptical about “Trump is owned”: it’s beginning to look very much like you were right and I was wrong.
@Bill Jempty:
I used Start8 only a few months and only sporadically, and that was back in 2012 or 2013.
I also keep my taskbar empty of pinned crap. Maybe you need to pin the icons to the taskbar, or maybe check if icons are combined. In the latter, you may have 25 instances open, but they show like one icon.
Sorry.
@JohnSF: I don’t know if it makes you feel better, but Nancy Pelosi has been saying that “Putin has something on Trump” since 2017 or so.
I think the unilateral proximity of Epstein to powerful people of all political stripes kept it buried. For example, Larry Summers was sending an email to his good buddy the convicted sex trafficker asking for help with a woman in 2017. That’s insane, even from the standpoint of an amoral jerk like Summers.
All these powerful people who were his buddies knew exactly what they were getting into and deserve no benefit of the doubt, even though I’m sure some of them were just trifling. Factor into that his ability to insinuate himself with Putin and Ehud Barak, and it looks exactly like the conspiracy theorists say (Mossad-run sex op blackmailing easy targets, aka pudgy American VIPs with no social skills and access to Viagra who are into teenage girls). Is that true? Probably not. But there’s no reason to show any mercy on people who were just firing off emails to him for advice on things after he got out of prison.
Podcast Recommendation:
Shield of the Republic: Why MAGA loves illiberalism
Discussion of the various right wing factions (post-liberalism, Catholic integralism, national conservatives, Christian nationalists, techo-monarchists, Red Caesarism, etc.
Talks about the intellectual underpinnings of the various movements. It is clear that many of these movements are not in the least compatible with each other.
@Beth:
This is an honest-to-god-question: How, or what, could be way way worse?
I just watched a clip of Megyn Kelly saying something along the lines of “well, these were 15, 16 year olds, there’s a big difference between a five year old and a fifteen year old”–to be clear, she’s NORMALIZING this, and it’s gross. But, it’s also something I’m familiar with in religious conservative circles. People who basically think that because 15 year olds were giving birth in the Bible, it’s fine for now too. I just can’t wrap my head around what would be bad “enough” if they are normalizing this.
@Kathy:
Kathy,
You have nothing to be sorry about. Thank you for the reply.
I guess I have the choice of using Start 11 with just 1 icon or delete the program and go back to Standard Windows 11 version of the start menu and task bar. Other than the 1 icon, I like what Start 11 did.
BTW on this pc I have three things pinned to the keyboard- Strat-O-Matic baseball, Notepad, and MS Word. For me it is quicker since I’m in those programs all the time.
@Bill Jempty:
I vaguely recall there are other shell programs for modifying the look of the Windows interface and taskbar. I just don’t recall what they’re called.
I think they’ve been around since the 90s, but until MS ruined the interface on Win8, they were rather obscure.
Google around, I’m sure there are a few.
@Bill Jempty:
You don’t mess with Texas.
@Jen: “This is an honest-to-god-question: How, or what, could be way way worse?”
Pictures.
@wr: Ah, yep. That would be worse. Also, ick.
@Modulo Myself:
I’m not usually inclined to conspiratorial speculations, and wary of “over-connecting” what may just be coincidence.
But in this case I’ll make an exception.
There are two threads in this that could do with pulling on:
item – Shortly after the (possibly somewhat under-explained) death in 1991 of Robert Maxwell, who was widely considered to a “player” in the murky waters of intelligence-adjacent activity, Ghislaine Maxwell moves to New York, and promptly starts moving in the same “social circles” as Jeffrey Epstein
item – Leslie Wexner, who about the same time effectively transferred much of his financial affairs to the control of Epstein.
And of course, Donald Trump was also paddling in the same pools
Also, on initial indications, a lot of the Epstein files seem to relate to offshore financial transanctions. Normal enough for a finacial operator; but who else has interests in such things for obvious reasons: dodgy businessmen, mafia/mafiya, blackmailers, “consultants”, shady lawyers, and intelligence operatives.
Categories which may turn out to have a considerable amount of overlap in this instance.
@Scott:
I heard an R congress critter on the news a few minutes ago spinning the coming increase in rates which is the result of the ending of the subsidies. He saidg that it’s the Ds fault because they were the ones who set the expiration of those subsidies and the Rs intend to “fix” Obamacare. Promised to “do it right”, he did, with permanent subsidies.
I once heard Obama say that he won’t know if the project was a success until the Rs claim ownership of it…and everybody stops calling it “Obamacare”.
The statue has returned. From the WaPo…
Another thought: the solidity of the Trump/MAGA/Republican alliance was the main threat to ongoing constitutional norms in the US.
If that collapses over the “Epstein files” because of a MAGA crack-up, and GoP electeds being less scared of being primaried by Trump, and calculating their personal primary and election vote positions (and who knows, even finding a shred of integrity left in the back of drawer somewhere?) then the risks of electoral shenanigans may recede.
And what if Trump really “goes full retard”: Congress votes for full release, and Trump vetoes?
“Katie, bar the door.”
@JohnSF:
There’s been reporting that the measure could pick up considerable Republican support in next week’s House vote. How then would Thune justify not taking it up in the Senate? Because if he does, it should pass.
How about that? I went searching for the Blue origin launch, and found the live webcast seconds before liftoff.
I watched most of it. The first stage was recovered successfully. The second stage lit and should have cut off by the time you read this.
I am convinced that if Trump is ever brought down for raping children, it’s going to be based on bullshit.
His base will ignore all real evidence, photographs, emails, etc., and then someone will see that he got a pizza with extra cheese and we all know what that means.
Hmm. I wonder if Comet Pizza delivers to Pennsylvania Avenue?
@Eusebio: I suspect there won’t be a vote. What requirement is there to honor a discharge petition? Norms? What’s a norm good for?
@Jen:
This. You’re right. Most sensible people need nothing more. Trump telling Howard Stern it’s okay to call his then-underage daughter “a piece of ass” and telling Wendy Williams the thing he most had in common with Ivanka was “sex” — that’s already worse, disqualifying on its own without pictures. Among the many other known-from-long-ago examples of Trump’s pedophilia (pederasty, for the pedantic.)
Ominous sign for Americans to need Garland or Bondi to release files with less bad quotes to figure it out. Anyone so lost in space would’ve ignored the DOJ anyway.
Many different reasons why they’ve been so dismissive: The daily gish gallop of MAGA outrages. Drowned out in the noise of other complaints about Trump. Americans too racist/sexist to hold rich white supremacists accountable. Poor critical thinking skills. Poor moral health.
But these reasons cannot excuse the willful ignorance here. If smart, sensible liberals are this slow on the uptake, how can we expect moderates and conservatives to hold Trump accountable?
And Epsteingate is not his worst crime. The worst is the attempted coup culminating in his Jan. 6 terror attack that even anti-Trumpers won’t call a terror attack. It’s sad.
This was entirely predictable and also evidence that this is the dumbest f*cking timeline:
@Eusebio:
But if it passes, and Trump vetoes?
I’m assuming a veto is possible on this: I am not a lawyer, certainly not an American lawyer, and most definitely not an American constitutional lawyer
Add to the general discontent enumerated here. Dow dropped 800 points today. On the plus side DJT (Trump Media and Technology) is down 64.72% for the year.
@Jen:
@wr:
@DK:
My suspicion of what can be worse?
Not pictures (I suspect Epstein and Maxwell were very careful with those.
Finacial details sufficient to lead to actual accounts and account records.
A lot are likely to be offshore, and therefore difficult to subpoena without US govt pressure, which is unlikely.
But if they are sufficient to connect to onshore account transactions that, I assume, a sufficiently motivated state prosecutor could pursue?
“Follow the money”, as somebody once said.
@JohnSF:
I’m assuming a veto is certain. Because this is the most transparent so-called administration that has no clue what transparency even means.
@Kathy:
If he does, that will split MAGA, and cause a lot of Reoublican electeds to start caluculating.
Becuase you then get the veto override vote circus.
Pair that with likely sub-optimal economics upcoming, and the 2026 elections start to look very interesting times indeed.
Amusingly, the Supremes might just save Trump on economics: if they strike down his tariff imposition powers, that could take the heat off inflation, temporarily at least, and enable the Fed to goose the economy via interest cuts.
But if Trump is stupid enough to veto the full files release, economics might just become secondary.
As it’s pretty certain that a lot will get leaked anyway.
@JohnSF:
And then some.
IMO, the fixer court will strike down some tariffs and let others stand, in the mistaken belief that giving El Taco half a loaf is better than taking away the whole. And that’s my best case scenario.
@Kathy:
An old engineering truism is “Knowing that something can be done is half the battle.” Also, SpaceX has been relatively generous in publishing papers about how they do it. Still, congrats to Blue Origin.
@JohnSF: “But if it passes, and Trump vetoes?”
Then Trump is announcing to all of MAGA that there is nothing he won’t do to protect a child molester.
Sure, some will buy his rationalization. But it’s going to peel off a chunk of his hardest-core supporters.
@Jen:
Pictures and financial records for starters. At this point I’m simply going to assume that video exists.
But beyond that, there are records showing that other rich important people knew and looked away. We need to drag Bill Clinton, Barack Obama, and Merrick Garland out into the street and give them all one chance to come clean.
For the purposes of clarity, I don’t think Obama or Garland visited the island. But Obama was in with Larry Summers and Garland obviously looked the other way on Trump. As far as I’m concerned, Clinton is a diddler until proven otherwise. They all knew shit was rotten and they either participated or did nothing.
I went from thinking this was all bullshit to, “no, this is the same shit as 08 when they let the bankers off the hook.”
I am unbelievably pissed as a queer person having been called versions of faggot and groomer my whole life and here’s these assholes not only getting rich off of raping teen girls, not only getting protected by the New York Times, not only getting protected by the highest levels of money and power, but then turning around and saying that people like me are the threat. Fuck all these people.
@JohnSF:
We should start a pool, I’m in on Trump vetos the release AND tells SCROTUS to eat shit on the Tariffs.
@Eusebio: @JohnSF:
We don’t need MAGA to completely crack up, we only need it to calve off about 10 or 20%, into a third party, or to sit out the election, either will do.
As much as it pains me to say, we’re going to have to reach out to those people. Political necessity suggests it. Usually an off-shoot hates the thing it came from most of all. We don’t want to get in the way of that. So not so much gleefully tap-dancing on their idiot skulls and pointing what cretins they are, we’re going to have to take a softer tone. Assuming the cleavage cleaves.
Jesus. It’ll be like the end of the Civil War. We’ll have to pretend they aren’t just scum.
I don’t like this. I’m really good at insulting people. This is unfair.
As week one of Hell Week progresses, were getting work piled on top of other work.
Now it’s a market study for a new customer. Problem is, their product requirement is broken up by several delivery sites, and that means replicating the prices and corrections and brands like 17 times. They’re not all identical, so I can’t even do one and copy the work on the rest.
The other problem is the manager hasn’t settled on what prices we’ll quote.
It’s due on the 18th, so I’ll have to work over the three day weekend.
I think I’ll have to resort to something pre-made so I can cook anything. I’m thinking pre-made meatballs with kasha. Quick side dish of chilaquiles with bean and chipotle sauce. That’s besides the rice and stir-fried vegetables I make for dinner.
The good news is the weather has cooled significantly, especially at night. For some reason, I sleep a lot better under a heavier blanket. I go to sleep faster, too.