Friday’s Forum

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FILED UNDER: Open Forum
Steven L. Taylor
About Steven L. Taylor
Steven L. Taylor is a retired Professor of Political Science and former College of Arts and Sciences Dean. His main areas of expertise include parties, elections, and the institutional design of democracies. His most recent book is the co-authored A Different Democracy: American Government in a 31-Country Perspective. He earned his Ph.D. from the University of Texas and his BA from the University of California, Irvine. He has been blogging since 2003 (originally at the now defunct Poliblog). Follow Steven on Twitter

Comments

  1. rondo1342 says:

    Oh, look! Fani Willis removed from the bullshit RICO Georgia case against Trump….the decision doesn’t kill the case, which should have happened, it just says nobody from Willis’s staff can be involved going forward. From what I’ve been seeing on smart websites (not this one) no DA in GA wants anything to do with this frivolous, specious case…they all know it was garbage from the git-go, and they would have never brought it to trial.

    And I lurk here often, but don’t often comment, because it’s utterly useless, but it appears I’m the first to comment on this open forum thread. MAGA!!!

    https://apnews.com/article/trump-fani-willis-georgia-election-indictment-removed-0aa6db3b7abed22eb08ed9323f687972

    1
  2. Scott says:

    In the vigorous discussion in the spirit of the Die Hard is a Christmas movie, let me say this:

    The Muppet Christmas Carol movie is the best Christmas Carol movie.

    4
  3. John-O says:

    @Scott: Almost. The Muppet Christmas Carol movie is the best Christmas movie, period!

  4. Rick DeMent says:

    The master deal maker strikes again … I’m pretty tired of winning already.

    House rejects Trump-backed plan on government shutdown, leaving next steps uncertain.

    4
  5. Pete S says:

    @Scott:
    I don’t know, it was kind of sad to see Michael Caine outperformed by puppets.

  6. MarkedMan says:

    @Rick DeMent: This speaks to the weakness of every other major Republican leader other than Trump. Speaker Johnson is completely incapable of taking any kind of strong action on his own. Sure, he’s a spineless, sycophantic weasel, but he wouldn’t be speaker right now if he wasn’t. And that is true for Mitch McConnell and every single other Republican in a leadership position.

    6
  7. Scott says:

    @Pete S: I am just the opposite. I thought Michael Caine was great. I am always happy to see great actors just let themselves be silly.

    3
  8. Jen says:

    @Scott: I *loved* how Michael Cain played that film. “I am surrounded by Muppets but I am going to act as though this is a serious period film” is just perfection.

    @Rick DeMent: The whole thing would be funny if people’s livelihoods weren’t essentially at stake. Republicans blow up the deal they negotiated with themselves after blowing up the deal they’d agreed to with the Democrats. What a bunch of utter clowns. Oh well, I hope all of the government employees who voted for this nonsense enjoy their holidays!

    8
  9. Scott says:

    The other night my wife and I watched the 1938 film, Holiday, with Cary Grant and Katherine Hepburn. Thoroughly enjoyable. Typical 30s farce. But I was intrigued by the theme of “living to make money or make money to live” in the movie. There also was a little light class division subtext throughout. And finally, a little astonished when Cary Grant and Katherine Hepburn in an argument with money-grubbing cousins turn around and give them a Nazi salute. The wife and I were “What? Did they just do that?”

    And lastly, did Cary Grant do those backflips, kips, and roundoffs himself?

  10. Joe says:

    @Scott: Much as I love me some muppets, I am partial to the Alastair Sim version. I have always loved how Marley’s ghost (Michael Hordern) pronounces “business” when upbraiding Scrooge. “BusIness? BusIness? Mankind was our busIness.” He really pointed out how their business was busy work.

    4
  11. MarkedMan says:

    There’s a new study out that shows positive records for the safety of Waymo taxis. The conclusions in the article are taken too far though. Based on insurance claims it shows that Waymo taxis have significantly lower rates of accident damage than human driven cars. However, it tries to compensate for the fact that Waymo excludes its taxis from more challenging roads and routes by only looking at cars registered in the areas of Waymo’s operations. While that helps, the fact is that while my car is registered in a particular area, most of my miles are spent driving it out of that area.

    Still, this is better than Tesla’s self study, which has a lot of hand waving and Elon’s “Take my word for it, you idiots!”. Those internal studies show that their so called Full Self Driving is very safe, but the most relevant thing about Tesla’s is that they have the highest death and accident rate of any car out there. Whether or not you believe Tesla’s claims about FSD, I think the high death rate is probably attributable to two things: first, although Tesla reveals very little about their study, it seems likely that they consider a situation where FSD suddenly disengages a few seconds before an accident, turning it over to an inattentive drive to handle, as a n0n-FSD accident. And second, their drumbeat that FSD is really ready to handle things on its own but is only held back by government bureaucrats attracts a lot of bad drivers and encourages the worst behavior in them.

    4
  12. Kathy says:

    @MarkedMan:

    One often needs to be reminded Boeing reported the MAX was safe.

    3
  13. Beth says:

    @rondo1342:

    Last Christmas, I gave you my heart
    But the very next day, you gave it away (You gave it away)
    This year, to save me from tears
    I’ll give it to someone special (Special)
    Last Christmas, I gave you my heart
    But the very next day, you gave it away
    This year, to save me from tears
    I’ll give it to someone special (Special, oh)
    Oh, oh, baby

    3
  14. Stormy Dragon says:

    I pretty much knew this was coming, but Stephen Fry has admitted he’s a TERF: https://www.thepinknews.com/2024/12/20/stephen-fry-stonewall-trans-backlash/

    4
  15. DrDaveT says:

    @MarkedMan: It’s hard to tell from the article, but it sounds like the study used all drivers in an area as the human comparison, rather than human-driven ride share segments, which is the correct comparison group. I could easily believe both that ride-share routes are less complex/challenging on average, and that ride-share drivers are safer on average than other drivers. Waymo is not taking vehicle miles away from teenagers, the elderly, immigrants who learned to drive in foreign countries, street racers, and similar high-risk groups.

    That said, it wouldn’t surprise me if Waymo really were safer on average than Uber or Lyft. The problem with AI isn’t usually its average behavior; it’s the edge cases. (Given that the edge cases for Uber include “robbed or raped by the driver” I think Waymo could probably make reasonable claims there, as well…)

    1
  16. Stormy Dragon says:

    Arizona approves a charter school with no teachers, and only two hours a day of LLM-based academic instruction, leaving the rest of the day available for political indoctrination:

    https://gizmodo.com/arizona-schools-curriculum-will-be-taught-by-ai-no-teachers-2000540905

    1
  17. Kathy says:

    I’m confused. Are the Republiqans in the House trying to pass a CR or a shutdown?

    4
  18. DK says:

    @Kathy: They’re also confused. House Republicans waiting to be given further instructions by the new Republican president-elect, unelected illegal-immigrant billionaire Elon Musk.

    4
  19. Lucysfootball says:

    @Scott: I thought Michael Caine was great. I am always happy to see great actors just let themselves be silly.

    Michael Caine had one of the great quotes from an actor (He appeared in Jaws 4, The Revenge):
    Michael Caine’s quote about Jaws: The Revenge is, “I haven’t seen it, but I have seen the house it bought my mother, and it’s marvelous!”. Caine made this statement to Australian television personality Andrew Denton after being told that Jaws 4 was terrible.

  20. Jay L Gischer says:

    “It turns out resentment is corrosive, and I hate it…” – Tony Stark

    “…even though I still seem to have it entirely too often” – Jay L. Gischer

    1
  21. Beth says:

    @Stormy Dragon:

    Well that’s a bummer.

    2
  22. Stormy Dragon says:

    @Beth:

    He’s always had this new-atheist just a little too pleased with his own cleverness vibe that made me suspect he was going to end up gravitating toward the alt-right

    1
  23. Fortune says:

    @Stormy Dragon: What makes you concerned about propaganda? They act a little bit like Tom Cruise, but I don’t see anything political.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WIXJrdjG8RY

  24. Jay L Gischer says:

    @MarkedMan: I mean, “weak” kind of applies. But they are leaders of legislative bodies. What they are supposed to do is count votes and negotiate. Which is what Johnson did.

    Republicans have a structural problem in that they fundamentally do not have a working majority – there are too many splinter groups even though they have a numerical majority. They might vote Mike Johnson out, but it won’t fix this problem.

    Though I have to say that it’s interesting that it’s people like Chip Roy who defied Trump this time.

    1
  25. Bill Jempty says:

    @Lucysfootball:

    Michael Caine had one of the great quotes from an actor (He appeared in Jaws 4, The Revenge):
    Michael Caine’s quote about Jaws: The Revenge is, “I haven’t seen it, but I have seen the house it bought my mother, and it’s marvelous!”. Caine made this statement to Australian television personality Andrew Denton after being told that Jaws 4 was terrible.

    in the late 70’s early 8o’s*, Caine was in a series of movie bombs- Beyond the Posideon Adventure, The Swarm, The Hand, The Island. Some people said Caine just did those films for the money. Heck we all got to do something to make a living. Jaws the Revenge was 1987 if I remember correctly.

    Another film Caine made in that late 70’s early 8o’s, Ashanti, has been supposedly called by Caine as the worst film he ever made. I’ve seen it, and the five others up above, and while Ashanti isn’t very good, its better than Beyond the Posideon Adventure, The Swarm, The Hand, The Island or Jaws The Revenge

    Ashanti because of its difficult African filming locations and casting and directing problems, may be the real cause of why Caine dislikes that movie.

    *- Caine also made California Suite and Dressed to Kill in that same period. Those weren’t bad movies and did well at the box office. The Island was a bad movie but did ok at the box office.

  26. MarkedMan says:

    @Jay L Gischer:

    What they are supposed to do is count votes and negotiate. Which is what Johnson did

    Sure, he negotiated a deal. And then dropped it without a fight the moment Musk/Trump squawked. You can bet Nancy Pelosi would not let Biden or Trump or any other lame duck or not-yet-President screw up a done deal. She would have gotten her troops in line.

    There are a few Republican congress critters with the courage of their convictions. Unfortunately they are uniformly idiots, fanatics, or loonies.

    4
  27. MarkedMan says:

    @Jay L Gischer:

    Republicans have a structural problem in that they fundamentally do not have a working majority

    This is a problem only because of the Post-Gingrich Republican rule that they will not negotiate with Democrats. Negotiating between parties and factions was the norm for over two centuries, but Republicans have made the absurd position that they should never give Democrats anything, so they have to pass everything with Republicans only. And the current speakers and other leaders are too weak to challenge this absurd position.

    3
  28. Joe says:

    @MarkedMan:

    There are a few Republican congress critters with the courage of their convictions. Unfortunately they are uniformly idiots, fanatics, or loonies.

    Ladies and gentlemen, I give you Chip Roy.

    4
  29. just nutha says:

    @Rick DeMent: And from here on up, it’s downhill all the way. Y’all gonna see winnin’ like you ain’t never seen. Laissez les victoires roullez!

    2
  30. Kylopod says:

    @Stormy Dragon:

    He’s always had this new-atheist just a little too pleased with his own cleverness vibe that made me suspect he was going to end up gravitating toward the alt-right.

    Well, Richard Dawkins has fallen down that hole as of late. Honestly, you see a lot more of this sort of thing in Britain than the US, with Labour moving in that direction as well. I don’t even know that you need to go alt-right, since anti-trans liberals are so normalized there.

    3
  31. just nutha says:

    @MarkedMan: Sure. But would Nancy Pelosi ever take the Speaker job under the condition that it takes one House Member to start proceedings to replace the Speaker?

    2
  32. MarkedMan says:

    @just nutha: Exactly my point. The only Republicans willing to run for the leadership positions are weaklings who are willing to accept humiliation.

    2
  33. becca says:

    Apparently president skum has endorsed AFD, the far right neo-nazi party in Germany.
    https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/elon-musk-gives-nod-german-far-right-party-election-looms-2024-12-20/

  34. Stormy Dragon says:
  35. Michael Reynolds says:

    @Stormy Dragon:
    Stephen Fry is not alt-right, FFS.

    1
  36. Gustopher says:

    @Stormy Dragon:

    Louisiana bans public health

    That’s all that was needed.

    4
  37. Gustopher says:

    @Michael Reynolds: He’s on a well trod path that leads there.

    It so often goes TERF, post-left, anti-anti-Trump-or-local-equivalent, anti-“woke”, alt-right. That first step is sometimes replaced with anti-#metoo, frequently because of credible accusations, but TERF is a new classic.

    Elon Musk did a speed run on this, because he’s so much more efficient than the rest of us.

    5
  38. Michael Reynolds says:

    @Gustopher:
    None of which says anything about Stephen Fry. He’s always been a man of the Left, a gay, atheist Jew, but one with a personal relationship with Rowling.

    1
  39. Mister Bluster says:

    Plan 9 From Outer Space!
    2:24pm est
    House Republicans voted in their closed-door conference meeting to pursue a funding plan that will require Democratic votes and strips out a debt limit measure President-elect Donald Trump is pushing, according to more than a dozen Republicans leaving the meeting.
    The plan will also include a one-year farm bill extension and the $110 billion disaster aid package Republicans negotiated with Democrats. Republicans expect they will vote on the package today, with less than 12 hours remaining until a shutdown deadline.
    Politico

    1
  40. Gustopher says:

    Today is the 100th Anniversary of The NY Times article “Hitler Tamed By Prison”.

    https://bsky.app/profile/ericcolumbus.bsky.social/post/3ldqv3umjds27

    HITLER TAMED BY PRISON. Released on Parole, He Is Expected
    to Return to Austria.
    Copyright. 1924, by The New Tork Times Company.
    By Wireless to THE NEW YORK TIMES.

    BERLIN. Dec. 20.-Adolph Hitler, once the demi-god of the reactionary ex- tremists, was released on parole from Imprisonment at Fortress Landsberg, Bayaria, today and immediately left in an auto for Munich. He looked & much sadder and wiser man today than last Spring when he, with Ludendorff and other radical extremists, appeared be- fore & Munich court charged with conspiracy to overthrow the Government.

    His behavior during imprisonment convinced the authorities that. like his political organization, known as the Volkischer, was no longer to be feared. It is believed he will retire to private life and return to Austria, the country
    of his birth.

    3
  41. CSK says:

    I touched on this yesterday, But I truly think the best way to drive Trump over the edge is by constantly repeating that Musk is really the president and that Trump is just his coffee boy.

    9
  42. Mister Bluster says:

    This link takes us to the bowels of the United States Government where the sausage is made.
    So far nothing is happening.

    1
  43. Mister Bluster says:

    @CSK:..Trump is just his coffee boy.

    And let everyone know that Trump’s tips will be taxed.

    3
  44. CSK says:

    @Mister Bluster:

    That would do it.

    Let’s all repeat, loudly and constantly: “Musk is the REAL president!!!!”

    3
  45. MarkedMan says:

    @Michael Reynolds: I’m not familiar with what Fry has said and not really interested, mainly because “TERF” seems to have become equivalent to “Dares to question my deeply held beliefs, and dares to consider studies that don’t support those beliefs.”

    2
  46. Mister Bluster says:

    I won $50 on a scratch off lotto ticket yesterday and then hit a deer on the way home. Other than the passenger side view mirror getting ripped off and the front passenger side door jammed shut and some dents the car survived and runs ok. I have minimum insurance coverage since the car is so old so unless I win more lotto money it won’t get fixed any time soon. The deer ran off into the woods.
    Maybe I should call my Representative in the United States House Republican
    Trump Toady nice guy Mike Bost before midnight tonight and see if he can get extra money for increased Social Security benefits in the new budget so I can get a new ride. Maybe it would attract Democratic votes.

    2
  47. gVOR10 says:

    @Stormy Dragon: Louisiana pretends vaccines (and the related diseases, presumably) don’t exist. DeUseless declared that global warming doesn’t exist. In NYT this morningDavid Brooks has a long, inane column saying that he’s decided to be religious, because he feels like it, truth being irrelevant. (No link, it’s not worth reading, and you know where to find it.)

    I share Reynolds’ opinion that religion is the root of much evil. But only if he’ll allow a loose definition of “religion”. A few days ago I commented that he had reminded me of “Thinking Fast and Slow”, which is about intuition and conscious reasoning. Intuition gathers a bunch of stuff related in some way and gives us a story. We can choose to consciously examine that story or just accept it because it feels right. The former is reason, the latter is, loosely, “religion”. Conservatism depends a lot on “religion” in this sense.

    2
  48. Lucysfootball says:

    So Musk endorsed the AfD, Germany’s far-right party. “Only the AfD can save Germany,” Elon Musk wrote, referencing the far-right anti-immigrant and anti-Islam party in Europe’s largest country. They’re too extreme for France’s far-right party, which decided to stop working with them.
    The party is monitored by the country’s domestic intelligence agency for suspected extremism. Party leader Björne Höcke has twice been found guilty by a German court of purposefully employing Nazi rhetoric. He has appealed the rulings. And in May the party’s top candidate, Maximilian Krah, was forced to withdraw from campaigning after he told an Italian newspaper that the SS, the Nazis’ main paramilitary force, were ‘not all criminals.
    So our shadow President is cool with Germany’s modern day neo-nazi party.

    6
  49. Fortune says:

    @CSK: A delusion of aggregated grandeur. Message-board liberals have been trying to get under Trump’s skin for almost a decade. If he noticed you, he’d laugh to himself or maybe double down.

    1
  50. CSK says:

    @Fortune:

    Which is of course why he fired Steve Bannon when Bannon was labeled his puppet master.

    Come on. You can’t possibly believe that Trump would laugh off any threat to his primacy.

    5
  51. Jen says:

    Trump is rather famously insecure and thin-skinned. He sued a former ghost writer (or was it a journalist?) for calling him a millionaire, and got all exercised about his tiny hands. He evidently really hates it when there’s a suspicion someone’s pulled a fast one on him.

    4
  52. CSK says:

    @Jen:

    Back in the 1980s, Graydon Carter called Trump a “short-fingered vulgarian,” and Trump spent the next 30 years bombarding Carter with photos of his hands to prove he has long, elegant fingers.

    Trump cannot bear being mocked.

    3
  53. Kathy says:

    @Jen:

    He evidently really hates it when there’s a suspicion someone’s pulled a fast one on him.

    If a certainty qualifies as a suspicion, this would only happen on those days that end in “y.”

    1
  54. Fortune says:

    Steve Bannon – the book Fire and Fury
    Timothy O’Brien – the book TrumpNation
    Graydon Carter – Spy magazine
    people on OTB – OTB

    Do you see the problem?

    1
  55. JohnSF says:

    So, Elron of Mars endorses the AfD.
    And “considering” funding for Reform in the UK
    Trump calls for Europe to go 5% GDP defence spending.
    Dear me.
    Has no-one in the Trump camp ever heard the saying:
    “Do not call up what you cannot put down”?

    A Europe dominated by the far-right, with a military budget greater the the US, defence technology capabilities rather ahead of China (and making Russia look like a rounding error) and (presumably) a central military directorate and command authority.

    What could possibly go wrong?

    4
  56. Mister Bluster says:

    The United States House of Representatives is now in session.

  57. CSK says:

    @Fortune:

    No. I can’t.

    4
  58. Fortune says:

    @CSK: That’s a delusion of grandeur then, if you think the comments section constitutes a threat.

    Anyway Trump didn’t fire Bannon until Bannon criticized Trump’s family. Stephen Miller was seen as an architect of Trump’s policies too, and Trump didn’t fire him. Not that Trump’s mature but saying he surrounds himself with the best people doesn’t get him mad.

  59. dazedandconfused says:
  60. Fortune says:

    @dazedandconfused: I’m sure this site’s comment section was the straw that broke the camel’s back.

  61. Kathy says:

    @CSK:

    There is no president but Xlon, and the felon is his bitch.

    4
  62. CSK says:

    @dazedandconfused:

    Say it and say it again: “MUSK IS THE REAL PRESIDENT!!!!

  63. dazedandconfused says:
  64. DK says:

    @Fortune:

    That’s a delusion of grandeur then, if you think the comments section constitutes a threat.

    Indeed. Not necessary for you/y’all to defensively whine about comments here day in and day out.

    Despite Team Trump now publicly pushing back against message board liberals’ President Musk memes — trying to placate the wounded ego of the narcissistic orange manbaby — no one here thinks vice-president Trump is as focused on complaining about “people on OTB” as you are. Relax.

    5
  65. Fortune says:

    @DK: So, you whine that people are whining. Limited value, but a gimmick is a gimmick.

    1
  66. DK says:

    @Mister Bluster: And the CR passed without the debt limit increase demanded by rapist felon Trump, Musk’s social media manager, who we’ve been told won a powerful landslide mandate.

    Will African oligarch president-elect Musk now do as promised: primary the Republicans supporting a CR whose passage required more Democratic than Republican votes?

    An embarrassing defeat for the orange manbaby some think should be in charge already. Score one for those arguing MAGA’s trademark chaotic incompetence will stymie Trump’s fascist desires.

    1
  67. Kathy says:

    As no one has quoted Shakespeare: “The lady doth protest too much, methinks”

    3
  68. DK says:

    @Fortune: Has excellent value in triggering you who whine about the people who whine that you people whine. Since, you know, you’re here every day frustrated over your failure to persuade OTB’s commenters. Womp womp.

    1
  69. Fortune says:

    @DK: More frustrated at their caliber.