15 responses to “Doug Jones’ Challenge”

1. 

   Not the IT Dept.

   November 25, 2017 at 10:34 am

   You could copy-and-paste a portion of the article for those of us not subscribers who are blocked by a paywall. Doug does it all the time. You’re not assigning homework, you know.
2. 

   Steven L. Taylor

   November 25, 2017 at 10:49 am

   @Not the IT Dept.: If you want to read a WaPo piece just open it in a private or icognito window.

   Homework solved.
3. 

   James Pearce

   November 25, 2017 at 10:53 am

   The article itself outlines the basic problem, although despite the definitive headline, the piece itself is based largely on anecdotal evidence.

   Sure, but if you want hard data, just look at election results.

   And this:

   “Right now, many African Americans do not know there is an election on December 12,” said state Sen. Hank Sanders (D), who is black and supports Jones.

   Defies credibility. I would bet that many African Americans, who are not nearly as ignorant or powerless as white people often think, do know there’s an election on Dec 12th; they’re just not that interested in it, considering it’s a contest between white dudes, neither of whom are going to do a damn thing for them.
4. 

   An Interested Party

   November 25, 2017 at 3:44 pm

   Defies credibility. I would bet that many African Americans, who are not nearly as ignorant or powerless as white people often think…

   The statement that supposedly defies credibility was made by a black man…perhaps he’s secretly white…

   …considering it’s a contest between white dudes, neither of whom are going to do a damn thing for them.

   Oh, so black people can’t think on a more complex level, realizing that another Democrat in the Senate can do more to help them, or at least not hurt them, as much as another Republican would? Ironic that you would make the statement about black people not being as ignorant as white people think…
5. 

   Franklin

   November 25, 2017 at 4:45 pm

   @Steven L. Taylor: I was not aware of that workaround, thanks. I’m not at the limit yet (today, or this month, or whatever it is) so I’ll have to test it later.
6. 

   James Pearce

   November 25, 2017 at 4:54 pm

   @An Interested Party:

   The statement that supposedly defies credibility was made by a black man

   Yeah, so? You think I didn’t read that part of the sentence?

   The only reason Hank Sanders went with “My people are too stupid to know about this election that’s been in the national news* for weeks” is because he knows a lot of white people, liberals included, really do think black people are that stupid.

   I don’t.

   I do not, for one second, believe that black people are unaware of this election. I think they are all too aware of it and are, in fact, unmotivated to vote for a white candidate. I know the implications of that are uncomfortable. But they’re going to have to be confronted if we want to move forward.

   * And most likely dominating local news too.
7. 

   An Interested Party

   November 25, 2017 at 11:01 pm

   The only reason Hank Sanders went with “My people are too stupid to know about this election that’s been in the national news* for weeks” is because he knows a lot of white people, liberals included, really do think black people are that stupid.

   Oh, so he is either a liar or a coddler of white people…it’s nice that you know him so well…

   But they’re going to have to be confronted if we want to move forward.

   Well hell, you’ve already appointed yourself to tell liberals what they should and shouldn’t do, why not just extend that role to black people (those who aren’t liberals covered under your first appointment) too…
8. 

   James Pearce

   November 26, 2017 at 7:32 am

   @An Interested Party:

   Oh, so he is either a liar or a coddler of white people

   Suppose he’s right then. That Alabama’s African Americans are so politically disengaged that they have no clue that one of their senators left for the Justice Department and was going to be replaced in a special election that has been BIG NEWS (nationally) for months now. That doesn’t strike me as a) very plausible or b) comforting.

   Also:

   you’ve already appointed yourself to tell liberals what they should and shouldn’t do

   It shouldn’t annoy you that I have opinions or that they’re different from yours.
9. 

   Steven L. Taylor

   November 26, 2017 at 10:05 am

   I think that in general, the overall population is less focused on elections, especially special elections, than one might think.

   Further, the population that only pays partial attention is more likely to not be fully tuned in to an unusual election date, like Dec 12.

   And, perhaps most important of all, since we as a country vote on Tuesdays (a work day), a lot of people (especially hourly wage/lower income citizens) don’t vote. And, hence, pay less attention.
10. 

    An Interested Party

    November 26, 2017 at 5:42 pm

    It shouldn’t annoy you that I have opinions or that they’re different from yours.

    Let me put your mind at ease, I’m more amused than annoyed, particularly by the fact that you don’t see elections as Steven noted above…
11. 

    James Pearce

    November 28, 2017 at 11:37 am

    @Steven L. Taylor:

    the overall population is less focused on elections

    Does this apply to Moore supporters too? I have a feeling they won’t find it so difficult to vote on a Tuesday in December.
12. 

    Steven L. Taylor

    November 28, 2017 at 11:51 am

    @James Pearce: Ultimately, I don’t expect turnout to be especially high, so yes. Note that even “high” turnout in the US is 60ish% (and that is for competitive presidential contests, not special elections).

    It is further the case the white middle and upper middle class voters typically have the luxury of missing some time to vote without any penalty at work, and they likely have no transportation problems.

    For some of Moore’s white working class voters, work and transportation difficulties certainly exist.
13. 

    James Pearce

    November 29, 2017 at 10:11 am

    @Steven L. Taylor:

    Ultimately, I don’t expect turnout to be especially high, so yes.

    Even if you assume turn-out to be lower than normal (and normal is pretty low), Moore’s supporters seem to be more enthusiastic about putting him into office, molestation accusations and all, than Democratic constituencies are about Jones.

    I hinted at it in a previous comment, but Democrats will never win in the south until they come to appreciate that African American voters don’t want to vote for white saviors. In the short term, we’ll need black candidates.

    In the long term, we’ll need to reorient society back towards racial integration and stop this annoying and destructive slide into segregation, this time voluntarily chosen and enforced not by law, but rigid social convention.
14. 

    Steven L. Taylor

    November 29, 2017 at 8:58 pm

    @James Pearce:

    Moore’s supporters seem to be more enthusiastic about putting him into office, molestation accusations and all, than Democratic constituencies are about Jones

    This likely true. Moore’s supporters are pretty strongly behind him. And, hence, turnout matters. I think you are missing how that works.

    we’ll need to reorient society back towards racial integration and stop this annoying and destructive slide into segregation, this time voluntarily chosen and enforced not by law, but rigid social convention.

    Sadly, the issue is not “back” toward racial integration, because we have never really had it.

    And you need to ask yourself why it is that the GOP is fairly homogeneous while the Democrats are more mixed.

    I say this because you come across as acting as if the blame for this should be equally shared by all.
15. 

    James Pearce

    November 30, 2017 at 10:56 am

    @Steven L. Taylor:

    Sadly, the issue is not “back” toward racial integration, because we have never really had it.

    No, we didn’t but that was the dream. “One day little black boys and girls will be holding hands with little white boys and girls.”

    Contrast that with Ta-Nehisi Coates’s “We Were in Power Eight Years” when you know the “we” doesn’t refer to Democrats.

    The end for MLK was clear: “Free at last.” I fear that the modern iteration of that is “Free from you.” That does not strike me as an improvement.